Finally Got a Boat

[Vortexman]

After Years of waiting and working my butt off.... the wife and I finally got our boat!!!! It is being built right now at the Vortex factory (Ontario, CA)!!! It is a 22 Vortex with a 496 HO. Going to break it in this winter so that it will be nice and ready for the Spring/Summer. My old man and I have built motors for our Muscle cars, but what is the trick to breaking in the motor for my boat?

[kevnmcd]

Welcome to the boards Vortexman and congrats on the boat purchase. To break it in just follow the manufactures recommendations....usually about 20 hours or so. Change the oil after 10 and don't go for long periods of time at WOT or one single rpm. Other than that....not much different than a car engine. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

P.S. Do you mean that it is a 22 Vortex by Essex?

[kevnmcd]

P.S.S. Nice Malibu. Is that a 66?

[Vortexman]

Not sure if I am posting correctly. I have posted three replies and none of them seem to be going through. Sorry... but I am a rookie at this so you are going to have to bare with me till I get the hang of this.

[kevnmcd]

No worries...let us know if you have any questions. You did great on your first post...picture and all. Most peeps have trouble with pics.

[Vortexman]

I am trying to send a picture of my boat right out of the mold but every time I hit "Add Reply" it does not seem to post. It loads like it is going to... and then nothing. Any suggestions?

Thanks..........

Oh... and I assume that is a picture of your boat? NICE!!!

[beer hunter]

Congrats on the new boat purchase http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif With a 496HO in a 22'er, your boat should really fly http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif Oh, welcome to the boards and please post some pics of your new boat when you can http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Vortexman]

Once again... sorry but I am a rookie.... but I am trying to send a picture of my boat right out of the mold and if the picture of my boat is 850KB.... is that too big to post? I just got a new Sony digital and I think that I had the settings too high so the pictures came out really big. Any suggestions?

[PUMP 'HER']

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 03 2003, 9:10 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Oh... and I assume that is a picture of your boat? NICE!!![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Shesh. Â*Just what he needs,a little more ego stroking. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/ohboy.gif
Congrats and welcome v-man

[Red Horse]

Welcome there V man. Sounds like a runner of a boat. Hope to see you at the lake this summer

[beer hunter]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 03 2003, 9:23 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I just got a new Sony digital and I think that I had the settings too high so the pictures came out really big. Any suggestions?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
The 640 X 480 size seems to work best for posting pics. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Essex502]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 03 2003, 9:23 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Once again... sorry but I am a rookie.... but I am trying to send a picture of my boat right out of the mold and if the picture of my boat is 850KB.... is that too big to post? I just got a new Sony digital and I think that I had the settings too high so the pictures came out really big. Any suggestions?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Resize the pic to 640 x 480 (shutup kevin!http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif using a photo editor such as Adobe Photoshop or Paint Shop Pro or any of dozens of editors - some are free.

Then, down at the bottom of the post window, where it says "File Attachments" click the browse button and find the pic on your hard drive. Once you find it and click on it, then if you're done with the post click on "Add Reply".

[kevnmcd]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 03 2003, 9:10 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I am trying to send a picture of my boat right out of the mold but every time I hit "Add Reply" it does not seem to post. It loads like it is going to... and then nothing. Any suggestions?

Thanks..........

Oh... and I assume that is a picture of your boat? NICE!!![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Yes, that is my sled...thanks for the compliments. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif Like BH said....make them 640x480 and you won't have any problems. I think when you get over 2000x? (whatever that number is) is when the boards kick it out. Besides 640x480 is a good size for posting, right E502?

[kevnmcd]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (PUMP 'HER' @ Dec. 03 2003, 11:33 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Shesh. Â*Just what he needs,a little more ego stroking.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Your just jealous it didn't say anything about yours! http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[kevnmcd]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 04 2003, 06:37 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Resize the pic to 640 x 480 (shutup kevin!http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif ....[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
E502 - As much as I hassle you about this....I agree. It is difficult to see the pic when you have to scroll around to see the whole thing for those of us that are Big Monitor challenged. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[PUMP 'HER']

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kevnmcd @ Dec. 04 2003, 07:54 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (PUMP 'HER' @ Dec. 03 2003, 11:33 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Shesh. Â*Just what he needs,a little more ego stroking.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Your just jealous it didn't say anything about yours! Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Not me. Long as mine gets me back to shore everytime I dont give a damn what "it" or anybody else thinks about it. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Vortexman]

Okay... here it is right out of the mold. Thanks for the help on resizing the picture!! I will send more when I resize the rest and as I get more.

[PUMP 'HER']

Looks nice so far. Unique graphics, nice color.

[Havasu Dreamin]

I didn't see it answered, so yes, that is a Essex 22 Vortex

[kevnmcd]

Thanks, HD.

Vortexman - Very nice. I love the colors and graphics.

[Essex502]

Vortex with a 496? Another leader of the pack! http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[kevnmcd]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 04 2003, 12:41 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Vortex with a 496? Another leader of the pack! Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Yep....right behind me. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[THOR]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 04 2003, 12:41 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Vortex with a 496? Another leader of the pack! Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
until you start racing

[Havasu Dreamin]

The Vortex with the 496 should see high 60's I'm guessing.

[kevnmcd]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Havasu Dreamin @ Dec. 04 2003, 1:23 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The Vortex with the 496 should see high 60's I'm guessing.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
He is getting the HO (425hp).....I would think low 70's at least.

[Vortexman]

Thanks everyone. My good friend and I came up with the graphics and the staff at Essex helped us get it on the boat. I am still trying to shrink the pictures so that they are not so big!!! Anyway, I will send pictures as I take them.

My wife and I are looking forward to meeting new friends and racing up and down the rivers/lakes!!!

What would you guys recomend for a break in lake? Been to Mohave a bunch of times, but wanted to go somewhere closer (Mission Viejo, CA) like either to Elsinore or Paris just for the first couple of times to break it in.

Any suggestions on lakes for break in? Thanks.....

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kevnmcd @ Dec. 04 2003, 1:36 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Havasu Dreamin @ Dec. 04 2003, 1:23 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The Vortex with the 496 should see high 60's I'm guessing.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
He is getting the HO (425hp).....I would think low 70's at least.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I have heard that the boat should do mid 70's.... some say high 70's... some say low 80's!!!

I guess that there is only one way to find out!!! After I break it in of course!!!

[KC & Karen]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 04 2003, 1:56 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kevnmcd @ Dec. 04 2003, 1:36 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The Vortex with the 496 should see high 60's I'm guessing.<span id='postcolor'>
He is getting the HO (425hp).....I would think low 70's at least.[/quote]
I have heard that the boat should do mid 70's.... some say high 70's... some say low 80's!!!

I guess that there is only one way to find out!!! After I break it in of course!!![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
With a 496HO you can easily turn a Bravo I 28p. We have a friend with a 25' Nordic Rage and a 496Mag turning a 28P to 78mph on the GPS.

There will be many opinions on breakin. A 496HO is very tight and it will consume oil for the first 100 hours before it calms down - so get into the habit of checking the oil every time that you take the boat out.

Consider this, 425HP turning 4000rpm is like doing 100mph+ in a good sized car, so in 10 hours you have only covered 1000 miles.

Also, the 496HO is self contained cooling and at this time of year will probably run at 160 to 170 degrees. The heat is removed from the motor very efficiently while the motor is running. It takes a good fourty minutes to heat soak the block during the winter months.

To me the most important break in is the first few heat cycles that are under moderate and varrying load. If it were my boat I'd follow the following schedule for a winter break in:

Saturday morning....
- place two 100watt light bulbs under the motor for at least four hours, or overnight, objective is to pre-warm the oil
- Check the oil with the boat on the trailer.....
- Check the coolant level with the boat on the trailer.....
- take the boat to the nearest launch and place it into the water
- Check the oil level with the boat in the water....
- Check the coolant level with the boat in the water....
- start the motor, allow to idle for a minute, then up to 2000rpm with no load for five to ten seconds to ensure the lifters are filled and clear
- idle out to the no wake bouys, open the engine hatch and look for leaks
- bring the rpms up a little bit and push some water around for five minutes or so until your temps are up to 160, quickly check the oil level again
- hit it good to get the boat up on plane, cruise around for twenty minutes or so, under 3000rpm
- set down in the water and check the oil level again
- Check the coolant level again
- spend at least a good two hours driving the motor between idle and 3000rpm

Do the same thing the second time out, third time out take it up to 4000rpm. After that you should have close to 10 hours on the motor and it is time for the first oil change, Mercruiser oil and filter. Keep in mind that you hours clock will be running whenever the ignition key is on.

Don't break the 4000rpms until your comfortably beyond twenty hours, then drive it like you stole it! http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[kevnmcd]

KC - That is probably the best "by the book" explanation of how to break in a motor! http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif But, realistically, how many of us broke in our engines like that? Under 4000 rpms for the first 10 hours? http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/crazy.gif Don't get me wrong....I think you are right on with your instruction, I just know for me personally I could never do that. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

HI

[titties and beer]

HI,not yet but i'm work'n on it http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif hello http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[ex cracker]

My 496HO has barely burned a quart of oil after 35 hrs. I did my best to follow kc's proceedure on break in but after about 15 hrs I started nailing it for short periods of time and was hitting 4000 rpm after 4 hrs.

[TooMuchFun]

Agreed on KC's breakin advice ... the key is to regularly make sure the fluids are not leaking, regularly check all of your gauges re: pressure and temp., make sure the engine is warmed up completely before any real load is applied, and vary your speed every couple minutes for the first 10-15 hours to make sure the rings and etc. seat evenly.

... and if the above is adhered to, after 3-4 hours if you crank it open to full rpms for 30 seconds or so you're not going to hurt anything ... just back it off quick and don't keep the hammer down for any length of time until you have 15-20 hours on the engine.

I would also recommend a pre-oiler kit and a filtermag unit on the oil filter ... the most wear on an engine occurs with starting due to non-lubricated metal grinding on nonlubricated metal when the oil is pulled throughout the engine. A preoiler is worth it's weight in gold for it lubricates the engine parts prior to startup. A filtermag is a large magnet that when strapped on the oil filter takes all the metal particles out of the oil as it passes the filter. This is a particularly important piece of equipment during breakin for you want as few microscopic metal shavings floating around in your engine as possible and during breakin you will have alot as the engine seats itself. I've used both of these on my engines from initial breakin and the difference in longevity is appreciative.

Your mechanic can recommend a good preoiler setup or you can look up the ad in an issue of HotBoat ... I believe someone on these boards is a dealer for FilterMag and the main company office is in Havasu (800 345-8376).

As a final point, I would switch to a good fully synthetic oil after the first 20 hours to further protect the engine ... Mobile 15W50, Amsoil, etc. are all good products.

Good luck with it, my previous engine on my current boat was Volvo's version of the Mag HO and it is a great stock production engine, and see you on the water ...

TooMuchFun

[kevnmcd]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Mrs.Vortex @ Dec. 04 2003, 4:22 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">HI[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Howdy, Mrs. V http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[KC & Karen]

TMF, good suggestion on the pre-oiler and magnet.

The oil pan on my truck has two huge magnets on it that I found at Home Depot. Unfortunatly the oil pan on the 496HO is alloy and I could not find a good spot for a magnet.

I agree with the use of synthetics but have concerns about use so early. I only say that because my motor building experience is from ten years ago, on a hand built motor I would be comfortable using synthetic after twenty hours. But these days things are way different, on a machine built motor the tollerances are so tight and the materials so different that I would worry about the rings seating properly. Mercruiser warranty is another consideration.

I have a Ford 6.0L Diesel and follow a few boards regarding all of the chaos with the motor - one topic that continueally surfaces is the debate between dino oil and synthetic. Finally I saw a post from an oil field scientist that explained the differences between the base stock used for dino oils and synthetic oils. Sounds like the base stock for sysnthetics is way richer in good lubrication particals becasue the oil is usually extracted from shale.... I'll look for the post. With 30k on the truck we just converted to synthetic oil and added a by-pass filter, with oil analysis I should be able to get 35k to 40k between oil changes.

This spring we will add a by-pass filter to the 496HO, I've changed that oil five times now and it is allways black as I pull it out. The by-pass filter will be very good for the longevity of the motor, marine motors certainly need to be severe duty.
www.OilGuard.com (http://www.oilguard.com)

[ccracing]

Vortexman,
Peris and Elsinore are probably the closest lakes but if you want to take a little drive up North 3 hours you have a choice of 2 pretty decent size lakes (Naciemento, approx 15 miles long and San Antonio, about same size and they are right next to each other in Paso Robles). The choices I had were Castaic and Pyrimid. When I first got my boat last February we made a weekend trip up there to break it in. The Lakes in Socal are way to small, and you get bored going in a circle 50-100 times, especially in winter. At least these lakes have some shoreline and scenery.

Very cool boat. We almost bought a vortex but they didn't want to budge on the price.

Chad

[Dr. Marg]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 04 2003, 1:48 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Thanks everyone. My good friend and I came up with the graphics and the staff at Essex helped us get it on the boat. I am still trying to shrink the pictures so that they are not so big!!! Anyway, I will send pictures as I take them.

My wife and I are looking forward to meeting new friends and racing up and down the rivers/lakes!!!

What would you guys recomend for a break in lake? Been to Mohave a bunch of times, but wanted to go somewhere closer (Mission Viejo, CA) like either to Elsinore or Paris just for the first couple of times to break it in.

Any suggestions on lakes for break in? Thanks.....[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Welcome Vortexman...very nice boat! Perris and Elsinore are your best bets locally. I would prefer Perris simply because its a nicer facility. Elsinore can be done, but I've seen too much sh*t in the water like fence posts, unmarked stumps, etc. If you stay within the high speed area and don't venture off you'll be fine. It's a little on the costly side there...they'll get for over $20 just to park and launch your boat. I've lost track of the rates at Perris. I live in San Juan capistrano and would love to help...just email me through this forum, it's called "PM". Good luck! Dr. Marg

PS: I'll bet your boat does 75mph once broken in and the right prop...what kind of prop are you getting with your Vortex?

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Dr. Marg @ Dec. 05 2003, 5:04 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Thanks everyone. My good friend and I came up with the graphics and the staff at Essex helped us get it on the boat. I am still trying to shrink the pictures so that they are not so big!!! Anyway, I will send pictures as I take them.

My wife and I are looking forward to meeting new friends and racing up and down the rivers/lakes!!!

What would you guys recomend for a break in lake? Been to Mohave a bunch of times, but wanted to go somewhere closer (Mission Viejo, CA) like either to Elsinore or Paris just for the first couple of times to break it in.

Any suggestions on lakes for break in? Thanks.....<span id='postcolor'>
Welcome Vortexman...very nice boat! Â*Perris and Elsinore are your best bets locally. Â*I would prefer Perris simply because its a nicer facility. Â*Elsinore can be done, but I've seen too much sh*t in the water like fence posts, unmarked stumps, etc. Â*If you stay within the high speed area and don't venture off you'll be fine. Â*It's a little on the costly side there...they'll get for over $20 just to park and launch your boat. Â*I've lost track of the rates at Perris. Â*I live in San Juan capistrano and would love to help...just email me through this forum, it's called "PM". Â*Good luck! Â*Dr. Marg

PS: Â*I'll bet your boat does 75mph once broken in and the right prop...what kind of prop are you getting with your Vortex?[/quote]
Thanks!!!

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 05 2003, 7:26 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Dr. Marg @ Dec. 05 2003, 5:04 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Thanks everyone. My good friend and I came up with the graphics and the staff at Essex helped us get it on the boat. I am still trying to shrink the pictures so that they are not so big!!! Anyway, I will send pictures as I take them.

My wife and I are looking forward to meeting new friends and racing up and down the rivers/lakes!!!

What would you guys recomend for a break in lake? Been to Mohave a bunch of times, but wanted to go somewhere closer (Mission Viejo, CA) like either to Elsinore or Paris just for the first couple of times to break it in.

Any suggestions on lakes for break in? Thanks.....<span id='postcolor'>
Welcome Vortexman...very nice boat! Â*Perris and Elsinore are your best bets locally. Â*I would prefer Perris simply because its a nicer facility. Â*Elsinore can be done, but I've seen too much sh*t in the water like fence posts, unmarked stumps, etc. Â*If you stay within the high speed area and don't venture off you'll be fine. Â*It's a little on the costly side there...they'll get for over $20 just to park and launch your boat. Â*I've lost track of the rates at Perris. Â*I live in San Juan capistrano and would love to help...just email me through this forum, it's called "PM". Â*Good luck! Â*Dr. Marg

PS: Â*I'll bet your boat does 75mph once broken in and the right prop...what kind of prop are you getting with your Vortex?[/quote]
Thanks!!![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I figured Perris would work for the first couple of times to put some hours on the motor. Then I am off to Laughlin so that I can put some hours on the motor at Mohave. I like to take care of my stuff so I will make sure that I follow all the break-in procedures. Thanks everyone for all of the advice.

The Prop that comes with the Bravo One X Drive is the Bravo I Prop. Pitch = 28.0

I am going down to Essex tomorrow to see the progress made on my boat this week. I will post some more pictures when I get back.

[TooMuchFun]

For KC -- thanks for the oil bypass filter site. I may set one up on my engine ... I have a hand built and dynoed Innovation Marine 540 ci/8.8 liter 650 propshaft hp custom powerplant, so went with synthetic oil after 20 hours. I have the same challenge as you mention, after 20+ hours the oil is pretty black, and the builder recommends that if I am running the engine hard that I change the oil every 10-15 hours ... becomes an expensive proposition.

On the filtermag option, it looks like 1/2 of a 6 inch deep cup without the bottom. Fits right on the oil filter. It's a pretty slick innovation, and just slides off the filter when you change the oil and filter. That way I don't have to find a place for a magnet on the engine. You just have to be careful that you slide it back on for if you get it close to the filter and your fingers are in between the magnet is so powerful that you're destined to break a finger and maybe lose some skin.

If you put a oil bypass filter on your 496, let me know what you think of the oil filtration difference.

TooMuchFun

[KC & Karen]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (TooMuchFun @ Dec. 05 2003, 9:46 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">For KC -- thanks for the oil bypass filter site. I may set one up on my engine ... I have a hand built and dynoed Innovation Marine 540 ci/8.8 liter 650 propshaft hp custom powerplant, so went with synthetic oil after 20 hours. I have the same challenge as you mention, after 20+ hours the oil is pretty black, and the builder recommends that if I am running the engine hard that I change the oil every 10-15 hours ... becomes an expensive proposition.

On the filtermag option, it looks like 1/2 of a 6 inch deep cup without the bottom. Fits right on the oil filter. It's a pretty slick innovation, and just slides off the filter when you change the oil and filter. That way I don't have to find a place for a magnet on the engine. You just have to be careful that you slide it back on for if you get it close to the filter and your fingers are in between the magnet is so powerful that you're destined to break a finger and maybe lose some skin. Â*

If you put a oil bypass filter on your 496, let me know what you think of the oil filtration difference.

TooMuchFun[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Where can I get a magnet like that, talk about simple and efficient!

On the 49HO I'm changing the oil every 15-20 hours also, bought two cases of the Mercruiser 25-40.

The by-pass oil filter is doing a good job on the truck. I have about 4k on the current synthetic oil with the by-pass - so far it has remained the same color and translucence as the fresh oil. I'm using the EPS-60 so that I do not have to change the filter very often, buying the same for the boat. Long term the filter should be very good for the rings and the bearings. Will be using Blackstone or CAT for oil analysis, casts about $15 and they tell you how many miles/hours to continue running the oil before next sample or change. Currently amsoil because I had it sitting in the garage, moving to Delvac 1 next.

The 496HO will be getting 40w synthetic as soon as I run out of the Mercruiser.


www.OilGuard.com (http://www.oilguard.com)

[TooMuchFun]

KC -- Call FilterMag (800 345-8376). Tell them what filter you are running and they send the magnet per filter size. Cost is about $100. An old issue of HotBoat ran an article with the oil analysis and cut the filter in half to analyze the particles retained by the magnet ... experimented on twin new 502s in same boat, one with the magnet and one without. Good data ... some old guy that could not find an amenable magnet for this type of application, so went into business for himself.

The oil bypass site recommends the EPS-20 for my size engine, but your thought on the larger sounds logical ... the more I think about it, the more I am inclined toward setting myself up with one.

TooMuchFun

[Rude]

vortexman, welcome to the club!! looks like a sweet ride.

[kevnmcd]

Vortexman - Where do you live in MV? Beer Hunter, No strEssex, and I live in Wagon Wheel.

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kevnmcd @ Dec. 06 2003, 8:25 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Vortexman - Where do you live in MV? Â*Beer Hunter, No strEssex, and I live in Wagon Wheel.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
My Wife and I live off of Oso.... not far from you guys.

Went to Essex today and looked at the boat. They just got done color sanding and buffing!!! I am going to attempt to post some pictures.

[Vortexman]

I figured out the Camera settings so now I am a post-aholic!!!

Here is another one.....

[Vortexman]

One More.......

[Vortexman]

Front View.....

They said that the boat should be done in a couple of weeks. I am sure that they are sick of me going down there every other day to look at it!!!

[beer hunter]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kevnmcd @ Dec. 06 2003, 8:25 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> Â*Beer Hunter, No strEssex, and I live in Wagon Wheel.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
That would be the "projects" of South Coto Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[Rude]

vortex, is that you in the second pic? if so, it looks like you should hit the gym once in a while you're looking a bit frail http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Trouble Maker]

You guys worry too much....

Vortexman...just put it in the lake and run it...it'll be broke in by the time you leave the no-wake zone. I wouldn't recommend 5000rpms for an hour up the lake though...just be sensible. One of the benefits of the 21st century called precision machining and little tricks like plateau honing.

Preheating the oil with light bulbs....yeah right...

http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Trouble Maker @ Dec. 07 2003, 10:04 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">You guys worry too much....

Vortexman...just put it in the lake and run it...it'll be broke in by the time you leave the no-wake zone. Â*I wouldn't recommend 5000rpms for an hour up the lake though...just be sensible. Â*One of the benefits of the 21st century called precision machining and little tricks like plateau honing.

Preheating the oil with light bulbs....yeah right...

http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Thanks..... I figured that I would just take it easy and get use to the boat and vary the RPMs (keeping them on the lower end of course). That is exaclty what I did with the 600HP Big Block that I built for my chevelle.... and that motor is not nearly as advanced as the 496HO in the Essex!!! I will take bits and pieces from everyones advice and will also use good judgement.

Only a couple more weeks!!!!

[titties and beer]

don't forget the"BEER " http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[kevnmcd]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 06 2003, 9:12 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">My Wife and I live off of Oso.... not far from you guys.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Let us know when you bring it home so we can come over and see it in person. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Essex502]

Vortexman - Don't plan on spending much time above 70 with that beautiful boat UNLESS you also added external hydraulic steering to it. This is required for safety when exceeding 70 with a Mercruiser outdrive. If you don't have it and the steering breaks you're toast! The cable for non-external steering drives isn't rated for speeds in excess of 70. This I got from Mercury Marine themselves. Be safe and add it if you haven't already. Single ram should be sufficient.

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 07 2003, 6:37 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Vortexman - Don't plan on spending much time above 70 with that beautiful boat UNLESS you also added external hydraulic steering to it. This is required for safety when exceeding 70 with a Mercruiser outdrive. If you don't have it and the steering breaks you're toast! The cable for non-external steering drives isn't rated for speeds in excess of 70. This I got from Mercury Marine themselves. Be safe and add it if you haven't already. Single ram should be sufficient.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Thanks.... that will definitely be something to look into once the motor is broken in. What does a set up like that run and is it something that is pretty simple to install?

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kevnmcd @ Dec. 07 2003, 4:02 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 06 2003, 9:12 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">My Wife and I live off of Oso.... not far from you guys.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Let us know when you bring it home so we can come over and see it in person. Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
You bet!!!!

[digginfordollars]

Welcome v-man, the boat looks good but I'm kind of interested in the tile on your garage floor. Is that the cheap peel and stick vinyl? Does it hold up to real world work i.e. fluid leaks, welding, dropping heavy items? I want to put that in my garage but I don't know if it will last. I might do the epoxy floor but the checker board sure looks cool. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[OutCole'd]

Kurt, if you are interested in that checker floor tile, call me first, I may be able to help you out.

[Trouble Maker]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (digginfordollars @ Dec. 07 2003, 8:58 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Welcome v-man, the boat looks good but I'm kind of interested in the tile on your garage floor. Is that the cheap peel and stick vinyl? Does it hold up to real world work i.e. fluid leaks, welding, dropping heavy items? I want to put that in my garage but I don't know if it will last. I might do the epoxy floor but the checker board sure looks cool. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Good call on the tile...I was wondering the same thing.

Hey D4$, when your done with your garage...come do mine.. Who knows how much per tile (sq ft)???

http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[OutCole'd]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Trouble Maker @ Dec. 07 2003, 10:28 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Good call on the tile...I was wondering the same thing.

Hey D4$, when your done with your garage...come do mine.. Â*Who knows how much per tile (sq ft)??[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I can check when I get to work & post it later.

[OutCole'd]

This thread has been jacked, Sorry.

[Essex502]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 07 2003, 8:44 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 07 2003, 6:37 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Vortexman - Don't plan on spending much time above 70 with that beautiful boat UNLESS you also added external hydraulic steering to it. This is required for safety when exceeding 70 with a Mercruiser outdrive. If you don't have it and the steering breaks you're toast! The cable for non-external steering drives isn't rated for speeds in excess of 70. This I got from Mercury Marine themselves. Be safe and add it if you haven't already. Single ram should be sufficient.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Thanks.... that will definitely be something to look into once the motor is broken in. What does a set up like that run and is it something that is pretty simple to install?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
You'll have to check with IMCO or Latham or some such vendor...I'd guess about $2,500 less labor. It's probably pretty easy to install if you're comfortable cutting holes through the transom of you brand new boat! I wouldn't be.

It's not too late to have Essex include it in yours! You'll be much safer with it.

[kevnmcd]

Vman - WPM quoted me $1500 for single ram...installation was about $300. Dual ram was about $2900 installed.

[Rude]

besides the fact that it's safer, it looks bitchin' http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (digginfordollars @ Dec. 07 2003, 8:58 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Welcome v-man, the boat looks good but I'm kind of interested in the tile on your garage floor. Is that the cheap peel and stick vinyl? Does it hold up to real world work i.e. fluid leaks, welding, dropping heavy items? I want to put that in my garage but I don't know if it will last. I might do the epoxy floor but the checker board sure looks cool. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I got the tile at Home Depot. It is a vinyl tile that is 1 sq ft per tile. They sell the glue at Home Depot also. I built my chevelle from the frame up on it which included a motor stand, Engine hoist, etc. I usually strip the floor once a year and rewax it with a rentable floor polisher from Home Depot. It has held up pretty well. However, the white gets dirty pretty easy so I have to mop it a lot to make it look clean. We installed black and grey tile in my buddies garage and it does not show dirt as well and it looks pretty good.

My garage is 21ft X 22ft and it cost me about $275 or so to do it. The hardest part is laying the first tile.... but some good measurements and a snap line take care of that.

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (rude235 @ Dec. 08 2003, 8:36 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">besides the fact that it's safer, it looks bitchin' http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Hahahhaha..... that is all that matters anyway!!!

I will have to get one... but I am going to get used to the boat before I worry about going 70+.

I tell ya, you start off with a base price.... next thing you know you want to upgrade everything and your base price becomes doubled!!! hahaha Some times I wish that the phrase "Keep it Stock" would apply to me..... but the little voice in my head keeps telling me to modify, modify, modify!!!

[TooMuchFun]

MODIFY ... it never ends until you blow up what you are currently riding in or upgrade to something else http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif.

Echo the hydraulic steering unless you want to end up dead or in the ER when your base system breaks down while you're flying down the lake without a care in the world ... and don't go the cheap route, put in the full package for you will upgrade your engine one day and need it. One of the many pluses of a Volvo powerplant is that anything over 400hp comes stock with a hydraulic steering drive system rated at 600+ propshaft hp and over 100mph.

TooMuchFun

[Rude]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Vortexman @ Dec. 08 2003, 8:59 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Some times I wish that the phrase Â*"Keep it Stock" would apply to me..... but the little voice in my head keeps telling me to modify, modify, modify!!![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
and welcome to the club http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

[Essex502]

Vman - If you're like the rest of us...in three or less years you'll want to get a big, faster boat to handle the rough waters in the bigger lakes. Temper you "upgrades" by this reality. Putting "upgrade money" into the current boat has to be weighed against putting the same dough into the next boat.

[beer hunter]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 09 2003, 07:12 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Putting "upgrade money" into the current boat has to be weighed against putting the same dough into the next boat.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
....And you wife’s willingness to let you spend on your next boat, twice what your parents spent on their first house Â* http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Dr. Marg]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 09 2003, 07:12 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Vman - If you're like the rest of us...in three or less years you'll want to get a big, faster boat to handle the rough waters in the bigger lakes. Temper you "upgrades" by this reality. Putting "upgrade money" into the current boat has to be weighed against putting the same dough into the next boat.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Hey Vman, Essex 502 is right on the mark. Before you get too confused with this hydraulic steering stuff, here's some clarity I hope will help you make a decision (I just went through this). The following is a basic guide with ballpark installed costs from the best to "good enough". Many boaters run 70 to 75mph without external reinforcement without problems. The boat manufacturers I've spoken to use 80mph at their guideline before jumping to external reinforcement.

1. Primo, top of the line: Full hydraulic steering. In lieu of cables controlling the movement of your outdrive from the helm, full hydraulic steering utilizies oil filled lines to stainless steel struts that connect to the sides of the outdrive. The other side of the strut is connected to a point directly on the transom requiring drilling through the gelcoat. This yields super smooth, super accurate steering and strut reinforcement to both sides of the drive. $5500 to $6000.
2. Nest best: Install only the external stainless struts. No hydraulic steering. Provides the same safety factor as with full hydraulic steering at a much reduced cost. $2500 to $3000.
3. Adequate: Install only one external strut for about $1500. Following the good advice of Essex 502, this is all you need because after a couple of seasons, your gonna buy a 25 footer. Water is rough when it blows 40mph. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/crazy.gif

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Dr. Marg @ Dec. 09 2003, 6:06 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Hey Vman, Â*Essex 502 is right on the mark. Â*Before you get too confused with this hydraulic steering stuff, here's some clarity I hope will help you make a decision (I just went through this). Â*The following is a basic guide with ballpark installed costs from the best to "good enough". Â*Many boaters run 70 to 75mph without external reinforcement without problems. Â*The boat manufacturers I've spoken to use 80mph at their guideline before jumping to external reinforcement.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Thanks Dr Marg.

I spoke with a guy at a Mercruiser Performance shop today and he told me that the best set up for my boat is to have steering dampners instead of the hydralic steering. He also said that the rule of thumb is 80mph for hydralic steering. Of course this is just his opinion but it is something to keep in mind.

Since I just bought the boat I am going to get used to it before I dump MORE money into it. The Toy account needs to replenish if you know what I mean!! http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

[Essex502]

That's interesting coming from Mercruiser as they told me at the boat show (2 different so-called technical experts) that 65 was there recommened speed limit without external steering. Teague also said 70 as well as the former service manager at Essex. Hmmmm...how can there be such a wide discrepancy?

Dr. Margarita...which steering dampers are you talking about? There is a company that advertise such in the back of Hot Boat but I've never actually seen one installed on anyone's boat...I'd like to get that at least until the next boat arrives which will have the full hydraulic steering.

[kevnmcd]

It sounds like there isn't a set speed at which external steering is written some where, but more of a personal opinion depending on who you talk to. Therefore, it is up to the individual to determine at what speed her/she is comfortable going without external steering. I hope we all make the right choice. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/huh.gif

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 10 2003, 06:35 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">That's interesting coming from Mercruiser as they told me at the boat show (2 different so-called technical experts) that 65 was there recommened speed limit without external steering. Teague also said 70 as well as the former service manager at Essex. Hmmmm...how can there be such a wide discrepancy?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Exactly!!! That is why I will wait till the Boat show and talk to all the "So Called" Experts and see what each one says. I definitely want to get the hydraulic steering but I am going to wait till I know exactly what I want and which brand.

Anyone know the dates for the next boat show? Went to Long Beach which is where I bought the Essex. I know there is one in January (LA or Anaheim?).

Thanks

[Dr. Marg]

IMCO is the only company I am aware of that makes dampers and hydraulic steering. I am sure there are others. Kevnmcd just did some research on dampers, maybe he can shed some more light.

[Havasu Dreamin]

48th Annual LA Boat Show (http://www.scma.com/boaters_show_info.htm) January 24-February 1, 2004. That is about 3 weeks earlier than in years past.

Vman, you'll love your Essex! We have been very pleased with ours since we bought it!

[Trouble Maker]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 09 2003, 07:12 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Vman - If you're like the rest of us...in three or less years you'll want to get a big, faster boat to handle the rough waters in the bigger lakes. Temper you "upgrades" by this reality. Putting "upgrade money" into the current boat has to be weighed against putting the same dough into the next boat.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I totally agree... Â*Save the money for your next boat (>25ft). Â*You'll only be going 70mph about 1 percent of the time anyway. Â*Wind/Big Boats = Big Water! Â*Hell, even my boat is too small..

[Essex502]

Note that Feb 1 is the Super Bowl for those of you who are also football fans!

[Havasu Dreamin]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 10 2003, 09:50 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Note that Feb 1 is the Super Bowl for those of you who are also football fans![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I bet the show is not crowded on that day!

[Essex502]

I know I won't be there that day! I always go the first day of the show. I'll be the one standing in line to get in!

[Havasu Dreamin]

I usually go during the week, on a Friday, as it is less crowded.

[Vortexman]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Havasu Dreamin @ Dec. 10 2003, 09:28 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">48th Annual LA Boat Show (http://www.scma.com/boaters_show_info.htm) January 24-February 1, 2004. That is about 3 weeks earlier than in years past.

Vman, you'll love your Essex! We have been very pleased with ours since we bought it![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Thanks for the info!!!

[Essex502]

I might do a second trip to the show on the Friday as well this year if it times out for my every other Friday off routine. When I get to technical with the builders, Lisa just rolls her eyes and gets a little bored with me. We'll see.

[kevnmcd]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Essex502 @ Dec. 11 2003, 06:43 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">When I get to technical with the builders, Lisa just rolls her eyes and gets a little bored with me. We'll see.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
They prolly (sp?) all know you by now and go runnin' when they see you coming! http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[Essex502]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kevnmcd @ Dec. 11 2003, 07:39 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">When I get to technical with the builders, Lisa just rolls her eyes and gets a little bored with me. We'll see.<span id='postcolor'>
They prolly (sp?) all know you by now and go runnin' when they see you coming! Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif[/quote]
Nahh....they like the checkbook that sits in my back pocket. We closed the deal by 11:00 am on opening day of the 2000 Boat Show with a $5K deposit to Essex. Prolly (sp) earlier than that but I was smiling more than watching the clock. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif Might just repeat itself!

[Dr. Marg]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Havasu Dreamin @ Dec. 10 2003, 09:28 am)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">48th Annual LA Boat Show (http://www.scma.com/boaters_show_info.htm) January 24-February 1, 2004. That is about 3 weeks earlier than in years past.

Vman, you'll love your Essex! We have been very pleased with ours since we bought it![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Who's all going and where are we meeting for cocktails?

[Essex502]

Sign the wife and I up for Saturday - opening day and them probably the final Friday by myself.

[No strESSEX]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Dr. Marg @ Dec. 11 2003, 8:38 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Who's all going and where are we meeting for cocktails?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I'll be there the 28th. How about meeting for cocktails before going into the show. BH and I went last year and drinks were a fortune at the show. http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[Dr. Marg]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (No strESSEX @ Dec. 12 2003, 5:42 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Dr. Marg @ Dec. 11 2003, 8:38 pm)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Who's all going and where are we meeting for cocktails?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I'll be there the 28th. How about meeting for cocktails before going into the show. BH and I went last year and drinks were a fortune at the show. Â*http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Wednesday, January 28? I'm in! Are you thinking getting into LA ahead of traffic, cocktails and then off to the show? If that's it, how about this for an idea. We meet at McCormack and Schmidts for cocktails and appetizers or early dinner? I think they have a shuttle that will take our drunk asses over there and back. I know they do this during Laker games. Plus there is a nice parking structure next to the restaurant. It's in the business district, very nice part of town.

[Essex502]

There is NO 'nice part of town' in that section of the city. Some sections are just less disgusting than others! http://www.lasvegashotboats.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif